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First-person versus third-person decision making

Sunday, 20 August 2023

Good Morning edwardlorilla1986.paxforex@blogger.com,

 

It’s 8 pm on a Friday night and I’m on a Zoom call with Ronnie Screwvala, the chairperson and co-founder of upGrad, an online higher education company last valued at over US$2.2 billion. 

 

Screwvala is in a car and the light from passing cars lights up his face on and off as we’re speaking. I’m on my Mac and Screwvala is on his phone.

 

“Each of us are a part and product of the choices we make,” he says. He is replying to my question about his favourite mental model or First Principle when it comes to major decisions at upGrad. 

 

I’m lost for a moment as I try to process what he said. To a question about how to make the right choices, Screwvala had just told me that we are a product of those choices. That was very, umm, meta. 

 

Mind you, metacognition is a thing when it comes to decision making. While “typical” decision making is about evaluating the pros and cons required to arrive at a decision, metacognitive decision making zooms out one level and looks at how you’re making decisions about decisions. 

 

I ask Screwvala to elaborate on what he meant. “I’m talking about placing yourself at the centre of your choices and decision making. In the first person. Most of us place ourselves in the third person. We don’t own our choices,” he says.

 

I think I’m starting to get his answer. The “first person versus third person” is an important construct for both writers and journalists. The vantage point or perspective of a storyteller changes the way a story is perceived by a reader. The “Rashomon Effect”.

 

But is the same true of decision making? We end up making a lot of decisions on auto mode, with no sense of how we’re placed as the decision makers. If a storyteller’s vantage point affects the story, wouldn’t a decision maker's vantage point affect the decision? 

 

“Third-person” decision making, to me, is when we haven’t spent enough time interrogating ourselves on why we’re making a decision, and what we truly believe in. We try to distance ourselves from the decision in order to bring about some notion of objectivity, I suppose. 

 

“Most of the time, people are in the third-person because they’re scared of the consequences,” says Screwvala. “When we’re centred on the first-person, the choices we make also tend to increase the accountability on yourself.”

 

Though Screwvala had used the word “centre” earlier, I had missed it. This time I’m able to immediately grasp the concept of “centering”. Though it has a different meaning in the context of meditation and mindfulness, I could see Screwvala’s perspective. Centering our decision-making perspective means examining our own deep beliefs and giving them adequate importance. At the risk of walking into philosophical territory, we become an indelible part of our decisions. A product of the choices we make. 

 

“I’ve two very good friends who are my age,” says the 67-year-old Screwvala. “They’ve both hung up their boots and now find it hard to see me spend 14 hours a day. But since I’ve taken that choice, it's helped me take away futile time trying to impress them or others. I’ve already visualised myself doing what I do,” he says. 

 

I think this edition turned out a bit more meta and philosophical than usual, and I have Screwvala to thank for that. If you want to listen to my full conversation with him from earlier this year, do follow the link below. 
Ronnie Screwvala on why upGrad is neither a startup nor an edtech | Episode 18, First Principles, 27 April, 2023

Listen on:
On a somewhat related, but also different note, Krish Subramanian, the co-founder and CEO of subscription-software unicorn Chargebee, spoke to me about a different kind of visualisation.
Krish Subramanian of Chargebee on continuously firing yourself | Episode 21, 08 June, 2023

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Like in the future, you want a particular type of success, that has not happened. And this one also has not happened.
 
Both the stories are residing in your head, and you have a preference for the first one. That doesn’t mean that is the right answer.
 
That was a breakthrough conversation for me. And then he said, then learn to internalise it as a preference. That is the outcome you want for the game. Understand that it is still a game. Then, play lightly with that preference. Don’t hold on to every decision that it has to deliver that outcome. But you say my preference is, this should be a $20, 30, 40-billion company and if that Northstar orientation actually helps, maybe you’re creating all the economic value, all kinds of successful outcomes for everybody. You play with that preference. Play lightly. Then it allows you to play with joy and a lot more creativity because imagine yourself every time when do  you come up with the best ideas? When you are at your creative best, when you are playing lighter. Not when you are actually tense and all of that, so tread lightly, like hold on to these as preferences. Learn to treat when certain things are preferences, when some things are actually becoming too tight, that you’re being right, or you want to be right.
 
The reason why you want to be right is you think that’s the only right answer is when that happens. And that was for me…that was like a holy shit kind of moment. And then it has been very helpful in a lot of decisions after that right.
 

And in my latest conversation, I spoke with Archit Gupta of Clear. We talked about:

 
1. His evolution, unlearning, and remaking as a CEO seeking to build a profitable and lasting company
2. Why he turned from a “business-focused” to a “product-focused” CEO a year ago
3. Why being misunderstood as a business has helped Clear stay under the radar and play the long-term game
4. How much of a cultural shift it took for Clear to start charging its customers to file taxes
5. Why Archit decided to expand from India to Saudi Arabia
6. Why passion for excellence, curiosity, and ambition are the three markers he looks for in people, all else being noise
Archit Gupta of Clear on anti-patterns and being misunderstood | Episode 24, First Principles, 17 August, 2023

Listen on:

Archit was guest #24 on the First Principles podcast. I’ve been fortunate to have spoken with an incredible set of founders during the first year of First Principles (ha!). Their candour, time, and insight has been incredibly rewarding to me as a “listener” (I am listening as I am talking to them).

We have a lot more ambitious enhancements and innovations planned for the second year of First Principles. Thanks for your support and time. Do please write in with any feedback or tips you may have to fp@the-ken.com. And if you’re feeling particularly generous and fuzzy this Sunday, rate us on your favourite podcast platform. 😊

 

Till next Sunday. 

 

Regards,

Rohin Dharmakumar

fp@the-ken.com
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